Exactly. I actually do think the word "permanent" does mean something. Some things can't be reversed. For example, ever heard the term "what you see can't be unseen"? Things you see are permanently with you. But anyway, if people are appealing permabans, they aren't permanent. So why not just call them "bans" and have the ban period be a really long time, then allowing the user to appeal? Of course, in some situations, a true permaban is necessary, for example if a user threatens another user to harm them in real life. But that's only really extreme situations. If someone loan scams a lot of times and gets permabanned for that? I think that after that user has matured for a while and is ready to put their head to it and repay their debts, then fine, they should be able to appeal, just after a very long tempban. And their appeal would have to be really, really good if they want another shot. So for the suggestion, +1. The term "permaban" doesn't mean much anymore. Like Mission001 said, the permaban system will probably work differently going forward, but as long as users will be able to appeal permabans to the owner, they're just bans.
People unsee things all the time. Just because it's hard to forget it doesn't mean you cant. If so amnesia wouldn't exist at all. Also if you want to get technical all bans that can be appealed are still permabans, however what if the person is denied all the time and stop appealing? Then it's called what? A permaban. It's all upto the server owner to accept it or not. Technically all bans are permabans until appealed because as long as the owner or a mod doesn't accept the appeal it is permanent. The permaban is there as a deterrent. If you really look at it you will see any ban can be a permaban as long as the owner doesnt accept you back. It's just a term we made up for a very stricked ban. As you can see there is only permabans. think about it.
-1 The perma ban system is fine how it is right now. Sure it doesn't follow "perma" but the quality of the appeals have to be really convincing, they need to show they learned their lesson and that they won't do it again.
In my eyes perma bans should be just that "permanent". I do not believe that they should be appeal able in any case. I believe that they should only be issued on very rare occasions such as using hacks, scamming etc and that the user responsible may never be able to appeal.
I would tend to agree that the term be revisited. If there have been successful appeals by players who were banned under this term, then it is not permanent. As for certain players who are judged to be worthy of a 'perma' ban, then a proper review can be done, with the accused player being offered the opportunity to provide their side of the story before a banning - without a expiry date - is handed down. Unfortunately bans are required, as this removes a certain player who through their actions cause a negative gaming experience for others. But let's just keep to terming it a ban. Should it be associated with a time then it is a temp ban. So should a player be temp banned, they know that after a certain date their access to the server is restored. Should they just be banned, then they can under some prescribed process appeal, for example after 3 months, only allowing one appeal per month until such time as it is deemed successful. Something along those lines. I believe what is being suggested here is not to do away with 'perma bans' but rather just the terminology be changed. ie: either you are banned or temp banned.
per·ma·nent ˈpərmənənt/ adjective 1. lasting or intended to last or remain unchanged indefinitely. "a permanent ban on the dumping of radioactive waste at sea" synonyms:lasting, enduring, indefinite, continuing, perpetual, everlasting, eternal,abiding, constant, irreparable, irreversible, lifelong, indissoluble,indelible, standing, perennial, unending, endless, never-ending,immutable, undying, imperishable, indestructible, ineradicable,ineliminable; More Its been said many times that bans are meant to be temporary given that user appeals. Perma bans are obviously not permanent so 1 of 2 things needs to happen. 1) Don't label them as permanent. 2) Make them actually permanent.
This is a highly controversial suggestion and you @dumdum71 are not looking into it in its entirety. The fact is all Bans are permanent unless appealed. This goes for even a temp ban. If the person never appeals or the owner never accepts them they are successfully permaband. Using the term permaban is just another way to show the crimes of the individual was worst then a normal ban. Thats how i see it. Since all bans are able to be appealed i don't see why permabans were ever incorporated. But the fact is permabans are permanent don't be mad at the term be mad at the person accepting the appeals lol.
You were the one saying nothing is permanent. The thought here is they should not be permabans, since it is not permanent. If it is a permabans it should not be appeal able. If it can be successfully appealed it's not permanent.
Permabans are not supported to be appealable thats what you aren't understanding. Don't be mad at the term. This suggestion should be about keeping permabaned players banned not getting rid of the ban itself. The reason the players are coming back is because the owner is letting them come back. Don't knock the system, look into the people enforcing it. No offense @staff I'm sure if you let these players back its for a good reason. But as you can see its causing a lot of confusion. This is the internet so definitions are important. Plz explain why you are doing this. I am curious too.
A temp ban is in no way a permanent ban. A temporary ban is a temporary ban. A permanent ban is a permanent ban. As shown before, a permanent ban is any ban lasting or intended to last or remain unchanged indefinitely. When a mod bans a player it is not intended to last forever. It is intended to be appealed, as said by many mods before. Therefore it is not a permaban.
If the appeal is denied over and over again and the player stopped appealing it is a permaban this goes for any ban its just how the owner or staff feels about it, any ban can become a permaban. Anyways even with official permabans themselves its the staff that accepts them. Don't get mad at the ban question why these people are able to appeal. I don't see why its so hard for people to understand that lol.
I know I've explained this three times already, here I go again. A perma ban is intended to last forever. All other bans are not. This means all bans except permabans are not permanent. "Permabans" are not permanent on this server. The user is suggesting that they are permanent. Even if the appeal is denied over and over, it does not make it permanent, aka intended to last forever. For all you know, they could be unbanned in 20 years, making it not permanent. I'm not mad at anything. I am simply trying to explain the difference between permanent and temporary to you.
I know you now mad. Thank you for trying to explain it. But as I said. Permabans can be permanent it's just how staff enforces it. They can do what they are meant to do the only problem is why this isn't being enforced that's what I think we should be looking into. Like Mission001 permabans work well if used correctly.
We understand they CAN be, we are saying permabans should ALWAYS be permanent. Otherwise call it a ban.
One thing i have always hated was that for big things like scamming hacking people get 6-12 hours of banning. I only go on once a day so if this happened to me, i would be like who cares. I think 48 hrs+ should be a MINIMUM for big deal bans.
I agree, but that's not happening for some reason. So the question should be what's going wrong with the system.
Look the term permabanned was used as a tactic to make people believe that if they did something bad enough they could be banned forever. Although there are cases where this is true...The fact is there really is no such thing as a permaban. I remember when X ray was a permaban and it was legit..appeals were auto denied as they should be and for the most part it worked. Then it became an appeal able offense that was decided by andrew. Now it is just a normal ban. In order for them to exist they have to be permanent. It's that simple. I agree there is no need for the term. I do believe there are offenses that warrant a permaban and they should be upheld....but that will be up to the new owner.
